Joe Esposito |
It has been no surprise to me, therefore, that
I have thus far been unable to post a response to my questions from a publisher.
But I remain hopeful that success is just around the corner.
The good news is that in the meantime Joe
Esposito has volunteered to answer my questions, and I think he has done so in
a direct, honest and no-nonsense manner. Whether one agrees with his views or
not, it is clear that Esposito is a very bright guy.
Esposito is no longer a practising publisher, but works as a publishing
consultant. I therefore believe it reasonable to conclude that
Esposito’s answers to the questions below provide us with a representative
picture of how publishers view the state of Open Access today [Esposito,
however, disagrees with this assertion: see below**]. And since Esposito is a self-professed “advocate of open access publishing”, the topic of
OA is clearly right up his street.
What are the take-away points from his answers?
For me, two things seem noteworthy. First, in their frequent complaints about
“greedy publishers” OA advocates tend to assume that publishers inhabit the
same moral universe as they do, one in which things like fairness are key principles.
Esposito reminds us that publishers operate by a different set of rules — the
rules of the market place.
This is apparent in his answers below. It was
also apparent in a discussion Esposito took part in on the Liblicense mailing
list earlier this year, where he pointed out that publishers would never pay
authors royalties for their journal articles unless they could see an economic
benefit for themselves from doing so. “What's important to bear in mind is that
that is the appropriate measure, the profitability of the entity making the
payments. Fairness has nothing to do with it unless perceived unfairness eats
into profitability.”
Esposito concluded with a quote from the 28th
President of the United States Woodrow
Wilson: “The truth is we are all caught in a great economic
system which is heartless.” (As a
matter of interest, here
is the context of Wilson’s quote).
For me this raises an interesting
point. Given what Esposito refers to below as the “moral urgency” of many OA
advocates, should we conclude that at the heart of the scholarly communication
system is an irresolvable conflict of interest between the aims and objectives of
publishers and those of the research community? Or is it simply that, as
Esposito suggests, the OA movement ought to consider “getting rid of the
idealists”?
This leads me to my second point. Could
it be that the OA movement has become so distracted by its constant discussion
of things like fairness and greed — and how one even defines Open Access — that
it has failed to notice the game is already up? While OA advocates continue to fill
mailing lists and social media platforms with their disagreements over definitions
and strategy, publishers are busy launching OA journals, and lengthening their Green OA embargoes; and doing so in ways that suit their needs, not
the needs of the research community. If true, the good news is that the OA
movement will get what it has been calling for; the bad news is that it may not
like the form in which it gets it. But then, as Esposito puts it, “The
marketplace has its own mind and makes its own decisions.”
It is perhaps for this reason that Esposito
ends by pointing out that he found my questions unexpected. “I deal
professionally with OA questions every day. The topics you raise are not the
ones the people I speak to are thinking about. They are studying how to build
direct-to-consumer services for their new customers, who happen to be authors;
how to optimize search-engine discovery; how to automate more aspects of the
service to drive costs down further (and then compete with lower prices); the
role of social media; and so on.”
Be that as it may, I think my second point draws our
attention once again to the gap between idealism and pragmatism. Idealists want to create
a world that they would be comfortable living in, pragmatists like Esposito
accept the world as it is, and then seek to prosper from it. And why wouldn’t
they? As Esposito likes to boast, he is currently making a lot of money
advising publishers and learned societies about OA.
But do please read the Q&A below. Esposito
makes a number of other noteworthy statements. He argues, for instance, that despite its merits, and apparent traction, OA will nevertheless remain a marginal activity. As
he says, “I don’t see OA becoming the primary form of scholarly publishing.”
Earlier contributors to this series include
palaeontologist Mike Taylor,
cognitive scientist Stevan Harnad,
former librarian Fred Friend and
SPARC director Heather Joseph.
The Q&A begins
Q:
In a 2004 article published in
First Monday you wrote, “While OA has a future (OA is the future), the debate
over OA does not.” I think it fair to say that you then went on to characterise
OA advocates as a somewhat naïve bunch, suffering from what you called a
“Change One Thing worldview”. You also argued that OA “will come about not
through a revolution in the world of legacy publishing, but through upstart
media built with the innate characteristics of the Internet in mind”, which led
you to suggest that PLOS and BioMed Central are not radical
enough — having “ensnared a killer whale and brought it to the circus, where
they expect it to behave like a trained seal.” In short, I guess you were
suggesting that OA will be additive, not substitutive to traditional models.
But does that article still accurately reflect your views on OA, and in what
ways have your views changed? (For instance, you did not appear to anticipate
that by now most, if not all, legacy journals would be offering OA in one form
or another. Indeed, some might be tempted to conclude that OA is in the process
of being appropriated by legacy publishers).
A: You packed
quite a bit into that question, and I’m not sure if I can respond to it all. The
basic outline of how OA has developed is pretty much in line with how I thought
it would be (but the debate goes on: I was dead wrong about that). The legacy
publishers have jumped in faster than I thought (I am biased toward start-ups).
My view of OA then and now is that it is a useful, marginal activity that opens
up a new class of customers through the author-pays model and that it would be
subject to the laws of market economics like any other thing. And that’s what
has happened. It is additive, not substitutive. And it’s a great development. It’s
just not a revolution.
OA is marginal in the sense that most research is
performed at a small number of institutions. “Most” is not the same thing as
“all.” Those institutions subscribe to most (not all) of the relevant
materials. So by definition the access granted by OA is marginal to what
researchers at the major institutions already have. Nothing wrong with working
on the margins, but let’s call it what it is.
The
essay you cite in your question was the first one I wrote on OA. I developed my
argument further a couple years later in The
Journal of Electronic Publishing, available here.
Q:
What for you have been the biggest surprises and disappointments in the
development of OA since you wrote that article, and why?
A: As I said above, the legacy
publishers jumped in faster than I would have expected. I am surprised that
Creative Commons has gotten traction with the OA movement. CC is basically an
administrative convenience, nothing more. It now seems to have picked up some
of the energy of those who want to storm the barricades.
The
biggest disappointment is with the rhetoric. It’s so extreme.
Q:
In 2004 you expressed some impatience with the various OA categories. However, I
think it fair to say that people still attach a lot of importance to the
distinction between Green and Gold OA, and there continues to be a great deal
of discussion (and disagreement) about the roles they should play. From the
perspective of publishers, what would you say should be the respective roles of
Green and Gold OA today, and
why?
A: My complaint about all the
varieties of OA (Budapest, Bethesda, whatever) is
that they are all top-down and before the fact. The marketplace has its own
mind and makes its own decisions. The marketplace has found a use for the Gold
model. The Green model has been less disruptive than I thought it would be.
For
publishers the author-pays model can provide additive revenues either for
entirely new journals or for a cascading system of journals. The Green model is
essentially a matter of compliance with funding agencies. Nothing inherently
wrong with either model. The art is in the implementation.
A: I don't have any evangelical
feelings about any aspect of publishing, not traditional publishing, not OA,
not hybrid OA. If people find it useful (as evidenced by their willingness to
pay for it), that's fine. If they don't find it useful, it goes away, at least
in theory, though many services lacking in demand get supported indefinitely in
some settings.
What
is sometimes called “double-dipping” is known in
other contexts as an aspect of two-sided markets. Rather than deplore the greed
of people who find more than one market for a product or service, why not
celebrate their ingenuity? Does anyone disparage a library because it decides
it wants to set up its own publishing program? I just don't see where all this
moral urgency comes from.
Q:
How would you characterise the current state of OA, both in the US and around
the world?
A: OA, as predicted, is being
absorbed into mainstream publishing. It is doing this by identifying a new
category of customers, authors, that provides a new source of revenue. OA
largely exists outside the library setting, which is ironic, considering how
many librarians are strong adherents of OA.
Every
week brings news of another traditional publisher creating an OA service. The
stunning success of PLOS ONE made them all sit up and pay attention. I literally
just got off the phone with a society publisher who wanted to talk about an OA
program. It just isn’t news any more.
As
for the international dimension, I can’t speak with any authority. Most
countries outside the US (except for less developed countries that create
little IP of their own) tend to be more conservative about publishing issues. The
exception is the UK, where all hell has broken loose. I don’t know where that
will end up. Scholarly publishing is a significant export for the UK and policy
decisions may get made with that stubborn fact in mind.
Q:
If OA is to become the primary form of publishing scholarly articles (as many
expect it to do) what in your view still needs to be done, and by whom?
A: I don’t see OA becoming the
primary form of scholarly publishing. You know, when you look around at the
Internet overall, you see that the proportion of subscription-based services is
growing, so you would have to make a case for why scholarly material is somehow
exempt from the forces that drive other networked communications.
For
OA to become dominant, librarians around the world would have to go to their
provosts and say they want to reduce their materials budgets by more than half.
That’s what it would take: self-immolation of the library community. Does
anyone foresee that? My view is that librarians, like everyone else, act in
their own interests, and today librarians are locked in an unholy embrace with
the traditional publishers, from whom they purchase materials.
Q:
What in your view is the single most important task that the OA movement should
focus on today?
A: Getting rid of the idealists. Let
pragmatism abound!
Q:
What does OA have to offer the developing world?
A: This is the “why isn’t Rwanda
more like Marin County” argument. Not my topic, and I don’t see why anyone
gives it much priority. The developing world has more fundamental issues
(stable government, access to clean drinking water, etc.) than trying to give a
researcher in sub-Saharan Africa the library resources of the faculty at
Stanford or MIT.
There is no point in opposing what are essentially
good-hearted intentions — Why would anyone want to do that? — but it would be
nice if people maintained some sense of proportion.
The
mechanical response to your question is that developing economies generate
little IP and thus would like to import as much as they can. OA makes that
possible. But we should not be surprised if first they wanted to establish
reliable electricity generation and an operating telecommunications system.
Q:
What are your expectations for OA in 2013?
A: 2013 is almost over. There
will be more OA announcements. We will probably get some movement in the US on
the OSTP’s plans, which will implement what is essentially a Green program.
There will be a new CEO at PLOS.
We might begin to see some downward pricing
pressure on the Gold OA services now that the competition is getting sharper.
Q:
In your First Monday article you argued that an unanticipated outcome of the
success of OA would be that “the overall cost of research publications will
rise”. Since the starting point of OA advocacy organisations like SPARC was that
the research community can no longer afford the traditional subscription system
how will the research community be able to cope with the fact that OA will
increase costs rather than reduce them?
A: I’m not sure that that
perspective has the story right. Here is another narrative for OA. Research
funding grows, but the money allotted to libraries to purchase materials does
not keep pace. Researchers are then stuck in a difficult position: they can get
funded for research, but have to struggle to publish to advance their careers. The
author-pays model, invented by a commercial entrepreneur, opens a safety valve
for those researchers.
Interestingly, many of the Gold OA fees are now being
absorbed by the funding agencies. So in effect the funding agencies are making
up for the shortfalls in library budgets.
I
must say that I find your questions to be unexpected. I deal professionally
with OA questions every day. The topics you raise are not the ones the people I
speak to are thinking about. They are studying how to build direct-to-consumer
services for their new customers, who happen to be authors; how to optimize
search-engine discovery; how to automate more aspects of the service to drive
costs down further (and then compete with lower prices); the role of social
media; and so on. Is there an OA bubble?
---
Joseph J. Esposito is President of
Processed Media, a management consultancy working primarily in the worlds of
publishing, software, and education. Esposito’s clients include both
for-profits and not-for-profits. A good deal of his activity concerns research
publishing, especially when the matter at issue has to do with the migration to
digital services from a print background.
Prior to setting up his consulting
business, Esposito served as CEO of three companies (Encyclopaedia Britannica,
Tribal Voice, and SRI Consulting), all of which he led to successful exits.
Typically he works on strategy issues, advising CEOs and Boards of Directors on
direction; he has also managed a number of sticky turnarounds.
Among other things, Esposito has been
the recipient of grants from the Mellon, MacArthur, and Hewlett Foundations,
all concerning research into new aspects of publishing.
== POSTCRIPT==
** Esposito emailed me
the following response to my introduction.
You correctly state that I am
a publishing consultant, but I also work for libraries, software companies, and
philanthropies. My clients are for-profits and not-for-profits alike. I cannot
recall when I last worked with a for-profit publisher. I have never worked for
any of the big commercial firms: Elsevier, Springer, Wiley, Sage, Taylor &
Francis. But I would like to.
Related to this point I would
add that the management of any of the firms listed above would choke to be told
that I represent their point of view. I have opposed one policy decision of the
big guys after another. The fact that I think that some OA advocates are naive
does not mean that I am in the same camp as the big commercial publishers. I am
non-ideological by nature.
Which gets us to pragmatism. You
contrast the idealists with the pragmatists, who simply want to profit from the
marketplace. Not so. I am very concerned with science and scholarship and
believe that I have made my small contribution to their enhancement. I am in
this for the money, but I am not in this only for the money.
Where we will always disagree
is in what I would call your unchallenged assumption that OA is good for
science. I doubt it is either good or
bad. Having recently visited my physician,
who reaches instantly for technology that makes me healthier, allows me to live
longer and happily, I ask myself: How
could all this be if Elsevier were truly stopping the advance of science? Commercial publishing demonstrably has been
good for science; our augmented life expectancies are the evidence.
So please find room for the
pluralist. I solve problems. The key to solving problems is articulating what
they are. This is the real failing of the OA movement: it is a movement, not a
strategic plan. Emotion clouds judgment.
A very interesting interview. I agree with Joe that market-forces will out, but the large number of researchers across the world who are adopting OA are a powerful force in the market. Likewise the research funding agencies are flexing their market muscle in favour of OA. As a former librarian I disagree with Joe about the effect of librarians acting in their self-interest. Self-interest and idealism both make a librarian look at value from the library grant rather than the size of the grant. Spending the library grant upon an OA repository provides greater value to users than spending money on big deal licenses.
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